Hulkamania running wiiiiiild!Posted: 2009-12-19 Filed under: eveonline | Tags: history, hulk, industry, mining, profit, scanning, ships, wormhole 8 Comments
Please don’t throw something at me, but I’m going to draw a comparison to WoW and Eve. In WoW, each server has about 2-3 thousand people. The equivalent of our market is an auction house, of which there are three of. There is no “Want to buy” option, and you can only post auctions, with buyouts.
Here’s where I’m going with this: cornering the market is fairly easy. For those who enjoy shooting things instead of making spreadsheets, let me explain: cornering the market is basically where you feel like increasing your wealth by 30% or so, by making other people complain. The only requirement to do this is to have so much ISK or gold pieces or whatever that a new player would sell a kidney to get as much as you have. In Eve, by comparison, with fifty thousand players online on a good day, you need so much cash a new player would murder a small town for their organs before you can think about cornering. Add to that that the issue I’m griping about today cost 100 mil before the cornering, don’t wonder if you see 3-4 towns go off the map soon.
Where were all these rich players when I was mining in a navitas?
The base concept is simple: pick something that everybody wants, say, hulks, or something, and buy all of them on the market, and relist them at 120% of the price you paid. As regular people see your sell orders for 120 mil, they will either undercut you by a little or a lot. If it’s a lot, like, say, 105 mil, then buy their order and relist it at 120 mil. If it’s around 119.5 mil, either buy it or ignore it if you’re low on funds and might need to buy more of the ships at 100 mil. Anyway, what this does is make all the miners very upset because they still really, really badly want hulks but they have to pay more, and since you have all the hulks, they have to buy from you. eventually, your strategy makes critical mass and you either run out of money and the price goes back down, or the new price becomes the norm and you get rich and everyone poorer than you whines when you pour that money into cornering the exotic dancer market or whatever.
Anyway, according to marketeers who enjoy making spreadsheets and some normal people, the cost of hulks first rose to 140 mil because the moon rebalance made some new goo expensive and the old expensive goo cheap, but no-one wants to sell the old goo cheap, so the prices now include twice as many expensive components as before. The fact that hulks are now at 190 mil is because jerks (read: players) with lots and lots of isk want more isk for some reason so they are all cornering the market AT THE SAME TIME. As such, hulks are spiraling high.
Way, way back in my life, my dad told me a story about the zebra… tulip? I forget. Anyway, the story was that people sold the tulip to other people, and the other people would sell it to other people for more, and on and on and on until one dude said “Why the hell am I trading my house for a case of flowers”. And the price went back down, to the sadness of all the flower sellers.
Since I mine in WH space with several friends, all in hulks, we’re being more careful than usual with our scanning tomfoolery, since 200 mil to replace a hulk doesn’t sit well with any of us. A quick check of EFT shows hulk max yield at 1360, and my yield at 1166. Covetor max is 1234, and 1019 for me.
So, according to that, first:
My mining yield is really sub par, so I should stop training drone interfacing and get back to ABC IV refining skills.
A Covetor isn’t that big of a step back, and I can certainly weather using one until hulk prices balance back out. God, I hope they balance out. WH mining is stressful as it is without feeling like you’re flying a ming vase.
As a parting note, why the heck can’t I moon mine in WH space? Seems reasonable to me. I suppose the counter argument would be that no-one can attack your PoS without a goodly time investment and luck, but considering we’re limited to one system before the logistics increases exponentially while tied to a fuggin rocket ship, woudn’t that balance things out a bit?
Fly… very carefully.
If moon mining was possible in wh, big alliances will move in. It’s too much passive income for the pvp guys to ignore. What keep small corps leaving in wh is that takes time and hard work to make it profitable. If a passive income were possible, lazy null sec dwellers would have spammed towers all over the place and kicked the small corps out of there.
P.S. Sorry the poor English, not my first language.
big corps would have trouble defending one system 23/7, methinks. Not my department
P.S. Your english is better than some native speakers I’d care to name.
From my recollection they at first, were going to allow moon mining in WH space. Why it was scraped, no idea. However CCP has said long term habitation of WH space isnt intended, which could be one of the reasons moon mining is not allowed at this point. Same with ice though to. I think that it could be that CCP doesnt want players ‘living’ in almost practical isolation from the rest of the game if it can be helped.
But we are proving them wrong about living in our unknown parts of the universe. Almost safe, almost suicide.
Some of the people in here haven’t left in months… They just ask other people to bring in new skillbooks, ammo, ships, ecetera. Vounching as a WH miner, on my first time out in a month, it was so freaky to have a local chat and actual belts on the overview you could warp to.
Same thing in ours, though I don’t mind the import and export business, it certainly pays well along with all the other fancy things in here.
btw A great CCP youtube vid from a keynote at fanfest this year, talks a bit about wormholes. They mention that, to kind of make up for the lack of moon mining in the wormholes their looking at mineable comets, and planetary ring mining.
Here is the address of the video @ youtube, gets on topic about 50 minutes in.
Whats your take on the Zephyr?
I’ve actually sold my Hulk for this very reason. I got 178mil for it, spent 42mil on a Rigged Covetor, 6 mil on insurance and I’ll get 20mil back if it pops for whatever reason and I’m now 130 mil better off.
As an up-and-coming business owner, and professional miner; it is disturbing to see these trends in our markets. For miners, the HULK is the last stepping stone in making it big (unless you count grinding for T2 mining crystals). A simple answer to this would be a boycott of both HULK, and Moon mineral buying that are required for the HULK. Otherwise we are all just giving into the demands of a very sad, and depraved group of Eve-Maniacs. The complicated answer? Root the source of the moon mining rip-offs. If not, it won’t be long before we are paying 300 Mil for an Abbadon, or 600 Mil for a Munnin.
First thought: Abbadons are tech 1, I don’t think the moon mining fiasco will extent to non-nullsec ores.
Second thought: WTH is a Munnin.
Sorry about the second thought, I’m gallente caldari and a bit shaky on Minmatar duct-tape monstrosities.
Anyway, at the beginning I assumed that the price was because of the double bottleneck. now, a spiral like you describe and suggest a difficult counter for seems likely.
With that bit of optimism, BOHICA. I really don’t think we can organize enough people together to not buy hulks.